hey Matthias,
I have come across Keypoints in one or two of the more interesting forums by now – actually in one of themyou also participated (Outliner Software – https://www.outlinersoftware.com/topics/viewt/8814/45).
I am one of those appreciating what you do and what Keypoints stands for. My high anticipation even increased above max after seeing the additional screenshots here on the forum about the graph of notes. (Even without workspaces for multiple documents – like in MarginNote and now LiquidText – this would be a blast!)
So, I don´t want to repeat the praise (though I could :-) ) – but actually the question from the quoted thread. Heading over to your webspace and this forum I gather the last activity is 1 1/2 years old (6/2021). Of course things are ready whenever they are ready.
But for all those 'in the wings' (and for me personally) it would be helpful to get an idea of there the project is at, resp. whether it is still a project, or where things are heading.
It will help letting people know if there is hope. Or if the search in term of PDF-annotation continues :-)
Thanks already for anything on that + best to you in this crowded times!
oliver
Re: state of project?
Hi Oliver,
many thanks for your interest in my app and for the kind words, it's much appreciated!
I understand that the lack of updates on the Keypoints website and forum may indicate to interested users that this project has been abandoned. But I can assure you that the app is still under continuous development.
That said, between regular work, family and other aspects of life, time available for development is still very much restricted. This is also the reason why I haven't updated the Keypoints website and forums: I don't want to generate more interest while it's not clear when I can deliver something. Also, given my time constraints, I currently want to focus on development.
I'd love to work on this app full time and pour all my resources into it. But I also have to generate a sustainable income now and obviously have responsibilities towards my family (so taking a huge debt is no option for me). And the project's feature focus & target user group is likely too much of a niche to gather any serious funding. In addition, with this project, I also want to stay independent (I've seen too many projects die or change in negative ways after having been bought or funded). Unfortunately, it's a common problem for indie software projects.
On the positive side, although much slower than I'd like, I do make progress. I've also talked about the various aspects and features of my app in other forums, some examples:
Implemented:
- use filter elements (like keywords, labels, publications, files, etc) to define a search context, and display related (co-occurring) elements (more info)
- search across relations: display all notes whose citing notes (aka "backlinks") or cited notes contain "..."
- filter notes by other notes, i.e. select some note(s) in the filter view to display all their cited notes
- self-contained plain text notes facilitate further processing with third-party applications (see here and here for some examples)
- parse each note into a data model of knowledge elements & relations, and expose this data in form of an API (scripting API example)
- typed links: use link types to describe the nature of a link relationship
Partly implemented:
- view (and ideally edit) multiple notes together, similar to Scrivener's "Scrivenings" mode (more)
Planned (for later):
- all knowledge elements (notes, publications, authors, keywords, labels, link types, etc) should be fully featured plaintext notes (see e.g. here and here)
- offer custom attributes, and display these in columns that can be sorted & re-arranged (see here)
Nonetheless, there's still some crucial functionality missing, there are a few crashing bugs (some caused by newer macOS system versions which I have trouble working around), there is a licensing issue to be resolved, etc. So I've still got some good amount of work to do before I can offer a public test version.
many thanks for your interest in my app and for the kind words, it's much appreciated!
I understand that the lack of updates on the Keypoints website and forum may indicate to interested users that this project has been abandoned. But I can assure you that the app is still under continuous development.
That said, between regular work, family and other aspects of life, time available for development is still very much restricted. This is also the reason why I haven't updated the Keypoints website and forums: I don't want to generate more interest while it's not clear when I can deliver something. Also, given my time constraints, I currently want to focus on development.
I'd love to work on this app full time and pour all my resources into it. But I also have to generate a sustainable income now and obviously have responsibilities towards my family (so taking a huge debt is no option for me). And the project's feature focus & target user group is likely too much of a niche to gather any serious funding. In addition, with this project, I also want to stay independent (I've seen too many projects die or change in negative ways after having been bought or funded). Unfortunately, it's a common problem for indie software projects.
On the positive side, although much slower than I'd like, I do make progress. I've also talked about the various aspects and features of my app in other forums, some examples:
Implemented:
- use filter elements (like keywords, labels, publications, files, etc) to define a search context, and display related (co-occurring) elements (more info)
- search across relations: display all notes whose citing notes (aka "backlinks") or cited notes contain "..."
- filter notes by other notes, i.e. select some note(s) in the filter view to display all their cited notes
- self-contained plain text notes facilitate further processing with third-party applications (see here and here for some examples)
- parse each note into a data model of knowledge elements & relations, and expose this data in form of an API (scripting API example)
- typed links: use link types to describe the nature of a link relationship
Partly implemented:
- view (and ideally edit) multiple notes together, similar to Scrivener's "Scrivenings" mode (more)
Planned (for later):
- all knowledge elements (notes, publications, authors, keywords, labels, link types, etc) should be fully featured plaintext notes (see e.g. here and here)
- offer custom attributes, and display these in columns that can be sorted & re-arranged (see here)
Nonetheless, there's still some crucial functionality missing, there are a few crashing bugs (some caused by newer macOS system versions which I have trouble working around), there is a licensing issue to be resolved, etc. So I've still got some good amount of work to do before I can offer a public test version.
Re: state of project?
Hi again,
In Keypoints, annotation notes from different documents can be viewed together. Whenever you select a note, its accompanying PDF gets loaded into the preview and the corresponding PDF annotation is brought into view (and briefly highlighted). So you move seamlessly between different source PDFs while you navigate thru your collection of notes. This behaviour is in fact the default mode, but you can filter your notes by certain publication(s) if you like.
Thanks, In case you haven't seen it yet, there's also a little screencast that shows the graph in action (also linked from the general introductions on Keypoints here, here and here).My high anticipation even increased above max after seeing the additional screenshots here on the forum about the graph of notes.
I'm not entirely sure if I understood this comment correctly. What exactly do you mean by "workspaces for multiple documents"?(Even without workspaces for multiple documents – like in MarginNote and now LiquidText – this would be a blast!)
In Keypoints, annotation notes from different documents can be viewed together. Whenever you select a note, its accompanying PDF gets loaded into the preview and the corresponding PDF annotation is brought into view (and briefly highlighted). So you move seamlessly between different source PDFs while you navigate thru your collection of notes. This behaviour is in fact the default mode, but you can filter your notes by certain publication(s) if you like.
Re: state of project?
hello Matthias,
thanks for the reply – very swift for a project that sails under the surface currently :-D – so, even more appreciated.
thanks for the reassurance that one can hope for this fabulous miracle ship to emerge from the waters eventually. that is good to hear.
thanks for the screencast links. wow! now my pulse runs even faster everytime my brain thinks 'Keypoints' :-D – the sidebar, which I only had a vague idea about looks terrific, as does the interlinkage of the window-logics. this is the stuff where real magic happens. easy (in some way) but also a gate to another dimension. even more respect, after seeing all the modes and their interactions. finally, to hear – and see – your atomic logic still fosters the ability to have (different!) ways to synthesize the different excerpts sets across documents is a blast. this will / would be a godsend. oh, and of course the integration w/ given managers, like Bookends, is another stroke of common sense married to genius.
... so, whatever you need to complete this – to some usable form – I wish to you (and me, and us) that it shall manifest!
if I´d be a multimillionaire I´d probably take 7 breaths and then would most certainly decide to fund you. unfortunately I am not. but I know what you talk about in terms of family, lifes to be lived alongside etc. so wish you good winds in your sails, so you can keep course in direction of what counts.
– just an idea, and probably not very original; but I am quite sure – seing the quality of this, seeing what you (already) have to offer (in terms of vision underpinned by something that can be realized in principle), and reading the enthused reactions along the way, whereever there is some appearance of Keypoints, I am quite sure this would take off as a Kickstarter (etc.) project. So, might be a way to bridge the final stretch... if it´s about that.
Anyways, like many, I will keep my eyes on it & press my thumbs, all that I have :-)
best & thanks again!
oliver
thanks for the reply – very swift for a project that sails under the surface currently :-D – so, even more appreciated.
thanks for the reassurance that one can hope for this fabulous miracle ship to emerge from the waters eventually. that is good to hear.
thanks for the screencast links. wow! now my pulse runs even faster everytime my brain thinks 'Keypoints' :-D – the sidebar, which I only had a vague idea about looks terrific, as does the interlinkage of the window-logics. this is the stuff where real magic happens. easy (in some way) but also a gate to another dimension. even more respect, after seeing all the modes and their interactions. finally, to hear – and see – your atomic logic still fosters the ability to have (different!) ways to synthesize the different excerpts sets across documents is a blast. this will / would be a godsend. oh, and of course the integration w/ given managers, like Bookends, is another stroke of common sense married to genius.
... so, whatever you need to complete this – to some usable form – I wish to you (and me, and us) that it shall manifest!
if I´d be a multimillionaire I´d probably take 7 breaths and then would most certainly decide to fund you. unfortunately I am not. but I know what you talk about in terms of family, lifes to be lived alongside etc. so wish you good winds in your sails, so you can keep course in direction of what counts.
– just an idea, and probably not very original; but I am quite sure – seing the quality of this, seeing what you (already) have to offer (in terms of vision underpinned by something that can be realized in principle), and reading the enthused reactions along the way, whereever there is some appearance of Keypoints, I am quite sure this would take off as a Kickstarter (etc.) project. So, might be a way to bridge the final stretch... if it´s about that.
Anyways, like many, I will keep my eyes on it & press my thumbs, all that I have :-)
best & thanks again!
oliver
Re: state of project?
Hi Oliver,
many thanks (again) for your kind & motivating feedback, it really matters to me!
I realise that I should produce more of these short screencasts, since they better convey how the app works.
For a Kickstarter campaign to be really successful, one would also need very good video and "marketing" materials as well as solid activity on social platforms. I have to admit that all of these requirements are not my core strengths, so I'm not sure if I'd succeed there. But, yes, I have indeed thought about this option. Still, I question if such an effort could really generate enough to bootstrap a niche tool with rather low visibility.
Nonetheless, I really appreciate your feedback & thoughts, thanks!
Matthias
many thanks (again) for your kind & motivating feedback, it really matters to me!
I realise that I should produce more of these short screencasts, since they better convey how the app works.
For a Kickstarter campaign to be really successful, one would also need very good video and "marketing" materials as well as solid activity on social platforms. I have to admit that all of these requirements are not my core strengths, so I'm not sure if I'd succeed there. But, yes, I have indeed thought about this option. Still, I question if such an effort could really generate enough to bootstrap a niche tool with rather low visibility.
Nonetheless, I really appreciate your feedback & thoughts, thanks!
Matthias
Re: state of project?
hey Matthias,
yes, I can only encourage you as to screencasts (– without pressing).
as to funding campaign: I see it´s a bootstrapping thing, in need of some resources and things in place. and I am also cautious, esp. since I am not in the position to have any real on-the ground experiences as to that.
I just see the potential. :-)
if you are contemplating something like this, do not forget it wouldn´t / shouldn´t be a one person project. I see a lot of admirers and (knowledgeable) people wanting to help / contribute.
I myself would be happy to contribute on the video aspect if hands are needed. I am sure there are other helping hands / heads / voices out there. and not to forget the self-interest in the potential outcome – a usable piece of splendid / unique software.
I am also sure, if I would have to approach it from a position like yours (the one you are describing sounds familiar to me ;-) ), then certainly the way to go, is to find some one in the know about such campaings, in such contexts (I´d also be sure institutions like the Open Knowledge Foundation, Wikimedia and others would be up for liasing any attempt and pointing to the right people...) again, feel free to tell me in case you need a helping hand here.
I think Keypoints deserves to be born! :-D
yes, I can only encourage you as to screencasts (– without pressing).
as to funding campaign: I see it´s a bootstrapping thing, in need of some resources and things in place. and I am also cautious, esp. since I am not in the position to have any real on-the ground experiences as to that.
I just see the potential. :-)
if you are contemplating something like this, do not forget it wouldn´t / shouldn´t be a one person project. I see a lot of admirers and (knowledgeable) people wanting to help / contribute.
I myself would be happy to contribute on the video aspect if hands are needed. I am sure there are other helping hands / heads / voices out there. and not to forget the self-interest in the potential outcome – a usable piece of splendid / unique software.
I am also sure, if I would have to approach it from a position like yours (the one you are describing sounds familiar to me ;-) ), then certainly the way to go, is to find some one in the know about such campaings, in such contexts (I´d also be sure institutions like the Open Knowledge Foundation, Wikimedia and others would be up for liasing any attempt and pointing to the right people...) again, feel free to tell me in case you need a helping hand here.
I think Keypoints deserves to be born! :-D
Re: state of project?
Hi Oliver,
thanks again, also for the offer to help out! I'll keep this in mind.
And yes, you're right, there are quite a few (non-programming) tasks that others could help me with. This will likely get more feasible when I can hand out a private test version to selected people.
Thanks again for all the encouragement!
Matthias
thanks again, also for the offer to help out! I'll keep this in mind.
And yes, you're right, there are quite a few (non-programming) tasks that others could help me with. This will likely get more feasible when I can hand out a private test version to selected people.
Thanks again for all the encouragement!
Matthias
Re: state of project?
hey Matthias,
I hope you are doing well!
I thought asking where things stand might be ok after 6 months lurking here :-)
– do you have any – updated – sense of direction for Keypoints?
It is still heavily awaited, I guess. :-)
I also guess a lot of people will look to other things developing in this area (like the hyped Readwise Reader and such things).
And maybe you have some new, or adapted ideas given the dynamics of the general field?
I´d still be happy to learn there is hope for Keypoints to rock my (PDF-)read-workflow, and by implication my whole PKM set-up!
very best!
oliver
I hope you are doing well!
I thought asking where things stand might be ok after 6 months lurking here :-)
– do you have any – updated – sense of direction for Keypoints?
It is still heavily awaited, I guess. :-)
I also guess a lot of people will look to other things developing in this area (like the hyped Readwise Reader and such things).
And maybe you have some new, or adapted ideas given the dynamics of the general field?
I´d still be happy to learn there is hope for Keypoints to rock my (PDF-)read-workflow, and by implication my whole PKM set-up!
very best!
oliver
Re: state of project?
Hi Oliver,
thanks again for your continued interest in my app, it's really appreciated!
Since end of 2019, my life went not as planned. I lost both of my parents and I got in charge to look after my ill brother. At the beginning of this year, right when things seemed to swing back to normal, my brother died (he got only 52 years old). This sad event has thrown me back again and I now have to (again) dedicate most of my spare time to organising all the tasks that need to be done.
Due to these issues I wasn't able to make much progress during the last months and this really frustrates me. But so is life and I will not give up. And feedback like yours helps me not to lose faith.
I understand that people have to look after solutions now. I haven't tried Readwise Reader but it seems like a viable option. That said, the two apps are (and will likely remain) fundamentally different. Compared to my app, Reader will also work with sources other than PDF, but it will require a subscription and may not be (apple)scriptable. My app will (for now) focus on PDF annotation and creation of atomic plain text notes — and put these (and not their sources) front and centre.
I still see Keypoints as a local hub to integrate with (and feed highlight notes into) other applications, like DEVONthink Pro, Bookends, Tinderbox, OmniOutliner, Scrivener or Obsidian. The goal is, e.g. via its scriptability, to have Keypoints be well adaptable to different workflows. Personally, I see it as a potential key component of a knowledge management workflow, but it should complement (not replace) other apps in that space.
Best, Matthias
thanks again for your continued interest in my app, it's really appreciated!
Since end of 2019, my life went not as planned. I lost both of my parents and I got in charge to look after my ill brother. At the beginning of this year, right when things seemed to swing back to normal, my brother died (he got only 52 years old). This sad event has thrown me back again and I now have to (again) dedicate most of my spare time to organising all the tasks that need to be done.
Due to these issues I wasn't able to make much progress during the last months and this really frustrates me. But so is life and I will not give up. And feedback like yours helps me not to lose faith.
I understand that people have to look after solutions now. I haven't tried Readwise Reader but it seems like a viable option. That said, the two apps are (and will likely remain) fundamentally different. Compared to my app, Reader will also work with sources other than PDF, but it will require a subscription and may not be (apple)scriptable. My app will (for now) focus on PDF annotation and creation of atomic plain text notes — and put these (and not their sources) front and centre.
I still see Keypoints as a local hub to integrate with (and feed highlight notes into) other applications, like DEVONthink Pro, Bookends, Tinderbox, OmniOutliner, Scrivener or Obsidian. The goal is, e.g. via its scriptability, to have Keypoints be well adaptable to different workflows. Personally, I see it as a potential key component of a knowledge management workflow, but it should complement (not replace) other apps in that space.
Best, Matthias
Re: state of project?
thanks Matthias,
I always appreciate your direct and straightforward answers. Thanks!
And first – and foremost – my empathy for you and your situation! I know what you are talking about – ... even if things are always different and somehow not comparable, I know how it is to be chased by life events, somehow beyond your direct control but not outside of your perimeter. from my heart, I wish you all the best in terms of inner compass, the neccessary energies, and good social support in all of that!
as to what you say on the issue of Keypoints – and comparing it to Readwise, and all of that: I totally get your point about the differences in DNA and character – just as you got my point about 'people always work with what is at head, and things move constantly'. And of course this difference, that you lay out, is why I am asking here :-)
but not to put mistaken pressure where there is no use in applying it in the first place. but simply to find out where things stand. or how possibly to support this. and maybe a little bit because I think it´s good to keep the communal whispering alit, a little ...
so, good energies + talk to you in 6 months ;-D
meanwhile only the best to you, with a view to all the challenges you (and we) face!
I always appreciate your direct and straightforward answers. Thanks!
And first – and foremost – my empathy for you and your situation! I know what you are talking about – ... even if things are always different and somehow not comparable, I know how it is to be chased by life events, somehow beyond your direct control but not outside of your perimeter. from my heart, I wish you all the best in terms of inner compass, the neccessary energies, and good social support in all of that!
as to what you say on the issue of Keypoints – and comparing it to Readwise, and all of that: I totally get your point about the differences in DNA and character – just as you got my point about 'people always work with what is at head, and things move constantly'. And of course this difference, that you lay out, is why I am asking here :-)
but not to put mistaken pressure where there is no use in applying it in the first place. but simply to find out where things stand. or how possibly to support this. and maybe a little bit because I think it´s good to keep the communal whispering alit, a little ...
so, good energies + talk to you in 6 months ;-D
meanwhile only the best to you, with a view to all the challenges you (and we) face!